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Being Tried

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    Posted: March/19/2013 at 1:05pm
Here's the situation brothers and I have to ask because I have recieved alot of different answers to the question Im going to ask. Last night at my lodge meeting I had a PM try me for my lapel pin I had just recieved as a gift and wore. He did this not only while we were voting but during a lodge meeting in general. I gave a quick response once he asked me what that was i explained to him my profession. After he voted he contiuned to come back to me and cover my pin. Now the answer I gave was an answer a PM who is my sponser told me to say in that situation. Brothers in your opinion how would you have handled this situation and moving forward.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hyksos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/19/2013 at 4:13pm
I am not PHA, so I will defer to the Prince Hall masons on this forum about how you should handle such a situation.

All I will say is that I am of the opinion that your property is yours, and nobody can legally take your property without your permission (except the government of course).


Edited by Hyksos - March/19/2013 at 4:28pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bellboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/19/2013 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by Hyksos Hyksos wrote:

I am not PHA, so I will defer to the Prince Hall masons on this forum about how you should handle such a situation.

All I will say is that I am of the opinion that your property is yours, and nobody can legally take your property without your permission.
I'm with Bro. Hyksos here, with the addition of that may be a good place to test one's knowledge, but not the time at all. Maybe before or after the stated.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Caution1010 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/19/2013 at 8:37pm
Been in that situation, did not know better then.

Now the question is: was he trying to teach you something? was he being a bully or both?

Sounds like if you were tried in the lodge room, its pretty much the location for education. if he was being a bully, then you would have to stand your ground as a man. if someone is mad at you for not knowing information, tell him to teach you, but he's not taking your stuff.
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ErmmConfused Not again!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NobleShabba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 8:09am
Originally posted by AFMII AFMII wrote:

Here's the situation brothers and I have to ask because I have recieved alot of different answers to the question Im going to ask. Last night at my lodge meeting I had a PM try me for my lapel pin I had just recieved as a gift and wore. He did this not only while we were voting but during a lodge meeting in general. I gave a quick response once he asked me what that was i explained to him my profession. After he voted he contiuned to come back to me and cover my pin. Now the answer I gave was an answer a PM who is my sponser told me to say in that situation. Brothers in your opinion how would you have handled this situation and moving forward.
 
Please confirm your statement "He did this not only while we were voting"?   You mean voting as in a motion on the floor, or during balloting?
 
If he did this while a motion is on the floor, he was out of order.  If it was during balloting, that is quite inappropriate.  That was not the time or place for such a lesson - if that is what he was trying to do.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 8:31am
Tell him to get his hand off of you.  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 8:33am
Originally posted by ga.mason ga.mason wrote:

ErmmConfused Not again!


I can think of worse things men within Freemasonry have done.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFMII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 9:12am
He definitely did this during balloting. But after hearing the responses I've heard, I've just come to realize that comeI'm not going to play the challenge games with anybody who walks up and puts their hand over light being displayed on my body. Drawing a big line there!! If trying me is done respectfully we can chat if the time is right. It only takes one time for me to go through someone trying to bully or embarrass me. Not trying to be non peaceful and cause confusion but, if this is something to continue then the foundation is set on this topic
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFMII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 9:20am
He definitely did this during balloting. But after hearing the responses I've heard, I've just come to realize that I'm not going to play the challenge games with anybody who walks up and puts their hand over light being displayed on my body. Drawing a big line there!! If trying me is done respectfully we can chat if the time is right. It only takes one time for me to go through someone trying to bully or embarrass me. Not trying to be non peaceful and cause confusion but, if this is something to continue then the foundation is set on this topic
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PHAlanx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 10:31pm
I have to agree with Bro. Caution on this one. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goomba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 11:33pm
Originally posted by PHAlanx PHAlanx wrote:

I have to agree with Bro. Caution on this one. 


Well you don't have to.  You can disagree to ruffle some feathers.Wink  Just kidding of course.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Caution1010 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/20/2013 at 11:49pm
He could, and I could make him not exist anymore
LOL JK
Not really.
I could not if I wanted to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 40Miles Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/21/2013 at 8:32am
Let me start off by saying there is no such thing as PHA masons, there are regular masons and irregular.  Now as for a Mason TRYING another Mason in my opinion once you have answered the question to the best of your ability its case closed. If you answered the question incorrectly the trying brother should educate you and move on.  Im a grown man so if anyone would ever attempt to take any item from me be it masonic or not there will be hell to pay.  and as for trying someone during elections or open lodge all I can say is WOW.....  Wheres the HARMONY in that?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NobleShabba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/22/2013 at 6:50am
Originally posted by AFMII AFMII wrote:

He definitely did this during balloting. But after hearing the responses I've heard, I've just come to realize that I'm not going to play the challenge games with anybody who walks up and puts their hand over light being displayed on my body. Drawing a big line there!! If trying me is done respectfully we can chat if the time is right. It only takes one time for me to go through someone trying to bully or embarrass me. Not trying to be non peaceful and cause confusion but, if this is something to continue then the foundation is set on this topic
 
Well, not quite.  I am interested to know what the WM and other PM's had to say about his actions during such a solemn and important ritual as the ballot.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFMII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/22/2013 at 7:50am
I had the opportunity to speak with a PM who is my mentor who was there at that time. We spoke last night on this subject matter and he informed that the person who did that also did that to him when he became a MM. I accept the the things he told me because of who he is, he knows his stuff. So at this point while it may seem like it was ok to others who have been through the same situation with the same person,I will remain cautious and humble, learn the lesson being taught , and also feel more confident in the fact of knowing that I EARNED the right to wear my light. With that being said may the G.A.O.T.U. continue to bless us all with the opportunity to respect, understand, and spread the cement of brotherly love to one another. SMIB
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Effingham Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/22/2013 at 8:40am
I must say, my brother, you have a way better attitude than I do. 

Color me a bit humbled. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AFMII Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/22/2013 at 9:02am
Well my attitude has changed. I'm more cautious and standing firm on what i will not tolerate. That was my first time in this situation but life changing at the same time.
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As Caution said. I think it depends on how someone approaches you. If they're trying to educate you, then absorb the knowledge. Sounds like he was out of bounds in terms of when he decided to do this. But if he's just trying to make sure you know what you've got on your chest, there's no harm in that. 

Older brothers ask questions all the time to make sure we're sharp. I appreciate them making an effort to educate us because if they do not pass along knowledge then we are weak. Most of the time that comes from some of our older 32nd or 33rds, who want to educate brothers. That is the gist of it. 

But, beyond that, I wouldn't be taking off anything -- ring, hat, pin, etc. -- for someone who asked a question for which I did not know the answer. It is not happening. Ask them to enlighten you, take the knowledge and move on.  



Edited by clark_kent0306 - March/22/2013 at 11:13am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote simple man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/23/2013 at 10:51pm
 I am afraid you handled it a lot better than I would have.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote simple man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/23/2013 at 11:24pm
Originally posted by 40Miles 40Miles wrote:

Let me start off by saying there is no such thing as PHA masons, there are regular masons and irregular.  Now as for a Mason TRYING another Mason in my opinion once you have answered the question to the best of your ability its case closed. If you answered the question incorrectly the trying brother should educate you and move on.  Im a grown man so if anyone would ever attempt to take any item from me be it masonic or not there will be hell to pay.  and as for trying someone during elections or open lodge all I can say is WOW.....  Wheres the HARMONY in that?

Well the irregular ones need to get some Activia LOL...
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You know, sometimes Simple Man just makes me laugh. Thank you sir. I needed a chuckle this morning.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote simple man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/24/2013 at 7:58pm
Originally posted by paullittrell paullittrell wrote:

You know, sometimes Simple Man just makes me laugh. Thank you sir. I needed a chuckle this morning.

Thanks, I try to be humorous sometimes.. Glad someone see's it as cutting up and humor, than to see it as being rude or something.. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Caution1010 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/24/2013 at 11:46pm
Originally posted by simple man simple man wrote:

Originally posted by paullittrell paullittrell wrote:

You know, sometimes Simple Man just makes me laugh. Thank you sir. I needed a chuckle this morning.

Thanks, I try to be humorous sometimes.. Glad someone see's it as cutting up and humor, than to see it as being rude or something.. 

He's canadian. LOL
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Simple Man I like that, I may have to use that in my travels. 
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I have to say... Trying brothers and being tried by brothers used to be something i enjoyed and looked forward to at lodge meetings, events, or whenever i met a new brother. Now i am older, and i like to think a bit wiser. Trying a brother on ritual knowledge is pointless. Some brothers are gifted with the ability to read and commit to memory the rituals with ease. Whereas others have to devote time before each meeting to going over and remembering only what they need say during opening and closing. My point is this...ritual knowledge does not define who you are as a mason. Anyone with a mind to do so can purchase a duncans or a lesters or read the rituals and lecture online. Knowing the ritual is great, but it doesn't define a mason. Masonry is in your heart first. So when you meet a brother... Greet a brother. If you doubt his legitimacy...ask to see his current dues card.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BroScubaSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/01/2013 at 7:21am
Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

I have to say... Trying brothers and being tried by brothers used to be something i enjoyed and looked forward to at lodge meetings, events, or whenever i met a new brother. Now i am older, and i like to think a bit wiser. Trying a brother on ritual knowledge is pointless. Some brothers are gifted with the ability to read and commit to memory the rituals with ease. Whereas others have to devote time before each meeting to going over and remembering only what they need say during opening and closing. My point is this...ritual knowledge does not define who you are as a mason. Anyone with a mind to do so can purchase a duncans or a lesters or read the rituals and lecture online. Knowing the ritual is great, but it doesn't define a mason. Masonry is in your heart first. So when you meet a brother... Greet a brother. If you doubt his legitimacy...ask to see his current dues card.
given ones jurisdiction, you will quickly dispose of someone who read exposes on the net or book they purchased. Our proficiency in nj is very different than duncans monitor and if someone tried to pass themselves off as a MM in public or tyled meeting would out themselves the moment they spoke the right ritual with the wrong wording if they went out of their way to forge a dues card.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote PMAce Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/28/2014 at 4:38pm
There is a time and a place for everything.  I am a fan of trying Brothers only as a teaching tool. As long as do with the Brothers best interest in mind.  But when it is used to belittle or make yourself look like the walking encyclopedia of Masonry it is not helpful to anyone.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ascending Soldier Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/22/2014 at 12:51pm
All of you gave AFMII some great advice and I thank you for that because I also benefited from it. I actually had this happen to me today at work where I was approached by a MM who in a room full of guys where besides myself was only one other MM. He noticed a pendant I was wearing and began to loudly ask me questions of which I knew the answers but I did not feel that it was appropriate to answer in front of everyone so he stormed out upset. Of course this bothered me but I basically chalked it up to his character as a man not a mason. Maybe he was just having a bad day or looked at it as a opportunity to embarrass a supervisor in front of others.At a loss  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote edwmax Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/22/2014 at 9:10pm
The 'covering, challenging, and taking of light' seems to be an excepted (old ???) practice & frat mentality that exist with PHA Masonry.   ... It is not done in mainstream Freemasonry.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Poet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/24/2014 at 6:21pm
Originally posted by edwmax edwmax wrote:

The 'covering, challenging, and taking of light' seems to be an excepted (old ???) practice & frat mentality that exist with PHA Masonry.   ... It is not done in mainstream Freemasonry.


Being in PHA Masonry- I have never heard of this being done nor discussed.
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Originally posted by Poet Poet wrote:

Originally posted by edwmax edwmax wrote:

The 'covering, challenging, and taking of light' seems to be an excepted (old ???) practice & frat mentality that exist with PHA Masonry.   ... It is not done in mainstream Freemasonry.


Being in PHA Masonry- I have never heard of this being done nor discussed.


It is discussed in many threads on this forum.     ...  PHA has a problem with clandestine Masons claiming to be members; and members of other clandestine groups attempting recognition.     PHA, many years ago, wrote a little booklet with questions and answers for their members to learn and to recognize each other by. ( I have seen it on the internet)  ... However, over time the clandestine PH got a copy for their members.  So these questions & answers has become useless.    But some old Lodges and members still do this.   And, the clandestine groups/masons very much still do the trial.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NobleShabba Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/25/2014 at 11:06am
I know this isn't the intent of the thread, but as someone pointed out before, if you are a REGULAR Mason, that's it. There is no such thing as "Prince Hall Masonry" we just have Masons that preserve the memory of Prince Hall by naming the operating body in his honor.

My statement is intended to correct any mistaken ideas that may be promoted by reading "PHA Masonry" or any other such reference.

Respectfully,
NobleShabba
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DISCLAIMER: These are my comments, and mine alone - they do not necessarily apply to any group to which I belong!
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Quarryman
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Joined: December/23/2013
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Poet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/25/2014 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by NobleShabba NobleShabba wrote:

I know this isn't the intent of the thread, but as someone pointed out before, if you are a REGULAR Mason, that's it. There is no such thing as "Prince Hall Masonry" we just have Masons that preserve the memory of Prince Hall by naming the operating body in his honor.

My statement is intended to correct any mistaken ideas that may be promoted by reading "PHA Masonry" or any other such reference.

Respectfully,
NobleShabba


Well said Brother...
I-09/24/13
P-10/28/13
R-11/26/13
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jdwalker519 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/08/2014 at 9:37am
This is why we say Prince Hall Affiliated.  As far as I'm concerned, though I come from a mainstream lodge, I see my Brethren of PHA lodges as no different.  We're all regular Masons, and they are just as much my brothers as any others.
J.D. Walker
Free and Accepted Masons of the District of Columbia
Royal Arch of the District of Columbia
Order of the Eastern Star, Grand Chapter of Virginia
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