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    Posted: July/15/2015 at 10:24pm
The videos from the CA Grand Lodge on YouTube indicate that there's a lot going on out there, and they have an online training program (among other things).  I'm interested in this.  Do any other U.S. GLs have the same kinds of programs?  For example, do any other Lodges require degree-related projects in addition to Lecture work?
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I've never heard off any such thing in blue lodge. Frankly, in most jurisdictions I've been to (including my own) we do well just to have a candidate who actually knows, and can recite proficiency in its entirety from memory. Which is sad, but also irritates me a little. Especially when I think back to what I had to memorize when I went through the degrees. We had to know it ALL then... From the opening ceremony to the working tools up to and including the entire obligation.

Now, I'll grant you that we were not required to study from a cipher book. All our study material was written out word for word in plain English, but it was still a great deal of work and memorization.

We were all well prepared then. When I completed my third degree, I could literally sit in any chair in the lodge and fill in if needed for the opening and closing in long form or short, and conduct degree work as well. I was raised in September and took the Senior Deacon chair in December.

Anyway... Sorry for the soapbox speech. Needles to say, I believe that candidate proficiency has severely dropped off, if not gone by the way side altogether, in favor of making new masons to "fill the ranks" Notice I didn't say making new Brothers... Many men become Freemasons...not so many become Brothers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote windrider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2015 at 8:13am
When I was Raised, there was no requirement for proficiency by memorizing the Q&As. Proficiency in Massachusetts is achieved by an understanding of the degrees through attendance at Lodge of Instruction. Certified instructors (I am one) work with the candidates after each degree to review the ceremony and point out the highlights. The candidates are then charged to find out more through reading Carl Claudy's books on each of the degrees. We would rather the new Brother understand the work than simply memorize it. 

Those who follow the path Grand Lodge has set for them tend to be the men you would be proud to call Brother. Those that do not seem to disappear rather quickly.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Sec'yBob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2015 at 8:48am
Windrider
 
I like your idea.
 
In Missouri, we no longer have proficiency [but maybe it should be brought back]
 
We are however, using and practicing mentoring, which before and after each degree, the candidate is walked through/talked through everything he just saw and experienced by an able Brother.
All our practices, procedures etc. are explained so that they have a complete understanding.  I too feel that it is important to understand more than just recite word, especially if the brother dosn't really understand the words he is reciting.  Ritual  can be overwhelming to some.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2015 at 8:52am
Absolutely agree! Knowledge and understanding of the degree are more important than simply memorizing the words. But when neither are required, but only recommended...well...   

Edited by Adept? - July/16/2015 at 8:53am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Anthony660 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2015 at 2:04pm
@ Adept-The online courses inthe GL Of Ca are a supplemnt to the printed non-esoteric teachings presented to the candidate. The candidate is expected topresent a paper on theirlearnigs fromthe books as well.  There is no esoteric work explained in the videos or included inthe manuals.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2015 at 9:36pm
Thanks for these responses, and thanks to Anthony660 for his comment about what's going on in CA.

I think my Lecture memory work has had a very positive effect on me.  It's required me to constantly and consistently think about both the ceremony itself and the meaning of not only the ceremony but also the Obligation, symbols, etc. of my degree.  It's inspired a lot of research on my part, not only with Claudy but also several others.  It's strengthened my bonds with my mentors and my brothers.  It's played a part in demonstrating (both to myself and to my Lodge) my commitment, and has made me excited about the possibility of Lecturer certification and playing an active role in the Lodge in that capacity.  

I think the memory work is great, especially when worked on alongside personal reflection and research.  I like the idea of online training and turning in papers/projects because I imagine they teach and reinforce lessons of the degrees and at the same time establish a "baseline" body of knowledge with which all Freemasons who underwent such training could be expected to work; for example, if I knew that all the Freemasons within a certain jurisdiction were required to study Claudy, Street, Haywood, and, say, Mackey, I would be able to assume that it would be possible to discuss in fellowship with those Brothers what those authors have written.  


Edited by lightbound - July/16/2015 at 9:40pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2015 at 3:17pm
Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

Anyway... Sorry for the soapbox speech. Needles to say, I believe that candidate proficiency has severely dropped off, if not gone by the way side altogether, in favor of making new masons to "fill the ranks" Notice I didn't say making new Brothers... Many men become Freemasons...not so many become Brothers.

And here is my "soapbox" to your comment. I have said this before in other posts where people have bemoaned the loss of proficiencies, but it bears repeating...

My primary lodge has a member who has no desire to advance through the line. He has made it to Senior Deacon, but he is satisfied to stay there. OTOH, he is the chairman of the golf tournament committee. Last year we raised over $3500 and it was only the first year we held the tournament!

There is another brother who has never held a chair. OTOH, he is the chairman of the membership committee. He calls every member of the lodge on their birthday and at least three other times during the year. He does this to let the brother know that the lodge is thinking about him and to see if he is doing OK and if there is anything he needs. He is also on the veterans visitation committee. Several times a year he and other members visit one of the VA hospitals in the region.

And there is yet another brother who has also never held a chair. OTOH he works with our lodge and his church as the liaison with the local food pantry. He works with the Missouri Department of Conservation's "Share the Harvest" program to see that unwanted deer are processed and the meat donated to the food pantry. In past years the program may have yielded a few hundred pounds of meat in our area, but last year, thanks primarily to his efforts in getting the word out, we donated over 2000 pounds of meat to the pantry. 

Now to switch gears, I actually saw a proficient "brother" taken out of his home in handcuffs by the sheriff because he did not fully understand the concept of subduing his passions... especially when it came to girls under the age of majority.

Now you tell me which of these four men you consider to be a true Brother? 

In closing, any man who completes the degrees as defined by the Grand Lodge in his jurisdiction is a Master Mason and has earned the right to be called a Brother. 


Edited by WBScott - July/17/2015 at 3:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2015 at 4:36pm
Brother Scott, with all due respect you have missed the point of the entire conversation of this thread.   This thread is talking about proficiency in taking degrees.. referring to candidates only not brothers after they have become master masons. whether they remain proficient or not is their choice.   I was referring only to proficiency of candidates. Once a brother becomes a Master Mason whether he remains proficient or not is up to him. as you have stated with your points in your post A brother can be a good member and a productive brother without being proficient In the degree work.   I myself am nowhere near as proficient as I once was However I'm still an active member of the lodge and I still contribute What I can when I can.   I feel I have offended you and I do apologize if that is the case. Again, I was referring to actually earning the title of brother by becoming proficient as you progress through the degrees. New candidates, not brothers who have been members in good standing for a long time.   Unfortunately, in my jurisdiction I see all too often many candidates come through Who cannot pass proficiency from one degree to the next yet they are still made brothers in due form And unfortunately many of those brothers contribute nothing more than their degree fees, and never return to the lodge And eventually end up suspended for nonpayment of dues.   We need to teach all new candidates Their proficiency and the meaning of the degrees when they first enter each degree.

So...in closing... Not every mason that I know has EARNED the title of brother.

Edited by Adept? - July/17/2015 at 4:44pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2015 at 8:23pm
From another recent thread:

Originally posted by WBScott WBScott wrote:

One of the problems we are having is that many of the guys sit back and watch the more "senior" members of the lodge put on the degrees. It seems to be so easy and effortless for these guys to perform pages and pages of ritual without stumbling or hesitating. Let them be your inspiration and motivation to start learning to do what they do. Like the guys in our area, they are getting older and one day they won't be able to perform the ritual any more and then where will your lodge be?


And I said...

Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

There are many very active and involved Brothers who don't now hold, and/or perhaps have never held a chair in open lodge.


So, it appears you spoke to my point in another thread, and I in turn spoke to your point. It seems we agree...more or less... And there is validity to both points.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2015 at 10:17pm
Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

Again, I was referring to actually earning the title of brother by becoming proficient as you progress through the degrees.

So...in closing... Not every mason that I know has EARNED the title of brother.

This must be something unique to your jurisdiction. In the initiation in Missouri, once the candidate has been obligated and while he is still kneeling at the altar and with his left hand supporting and the right hand resting upon the Holy Bible, square and compasses, the Worshipful Master addresses him as Brother Doe and instructs him to detach his hands from the Bible. From that point on, that man is a Brother.... my Brother. Period. He does not have to do anything else in order for me to refer to him as a Brother.


Edited by WBScott - July/17/2015 at 10:53pm
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(what is otoh?)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 12:30am
on the other hand??

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in MO, what separates degrees?  for example, here in AR we do memory work, and after "turning it in" and being approved our next degree ceremony is scheduled.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 4:33am
Again, that's what I'm referring to. Proficiency requirements between degrees. Once you take the first degree, you are presented with some reading, and study material. It is explained, and the ceremony that has just taken place is also elaborated on. It is also explained to the candidate at that point that he is expected to memorize a portion (a VERY SMALL portion in comparison to what I was required to learn) and that he will have to stand before an examination committee(or in open lodge for all to see) and answer the questions from the required memorization portion. It is called "delivering/giving/returning/or turning in(as lightbound said) proficiency" and all candidates are required to do it before passing to the next degree.

Unfortunately...even when the candidate fails miserably at proficiency, and can't answer even the simplest of questions, he is allowed to pass, and even be raised.

Call me "old school" or perhaps it was just how I was taught by my JW when I was going through...but when I meet a brother that I don't know on the street, I grip him on the first degree, and cover the grip with my free hand. I then proceed to "build the temple" (go through the grips and words from EA up to the pass grip of a MM.(privacy permitting of course) If the Brother can't perform that simple task...then I will be off...not from, and Masonic communication will cease. If I meet a brother that I know personally...I'll ask him a question. If he knows the answer, then he asks me a question..and so on, until one of us is stumped, and has to go look it up and get back to the other with the correct answer. It keeps us all sharp. (And its fun) We keep each other sharp. I expect nothing less from our candidates. If anything, I expect more from them because they are new, and need to prove themselves. (By having been often tried, never denied, and ready to be tried again.)

If they don't take the time, or put forth the effort to know/learn ritual proficiency as candidates, then why should we expect they will after they are raised? If they are not required to know, understand, and be able to explain the initiation ceremony THAT THEY WENT THROUGH... Then why bother with the ceremony at all? Why not just bring them in, have them kneel and take the obligation, wait a month, and do it again. Why even wait a month for that matter...why not have them take the obligation for all 3 degrees in the same night?

...anyway...my opinion.

Edited by Adept? - July/18/2015 at 6:17am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 7:18am
Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

If they don't take the time, or put forth the effort to know/learn ritual proficiency as candidates, then why should we expect they will after they are raised?

You can't just expect someone to jump in with both feet the very instant they receive the 3rd Degree charge.  They have no idea what goes on in a lodge or what it takes to make it work. There is so much "sensory overload", especially in the 3rd Degree, that most guys just leave wondering what in the heck just happened that night. 

Don't get me wrong, ritual is very important. We can't conduct our meetings without it and we certainly can't confer the degrees without it. The fact is  that only some guys will be impressed with the ritual and will be motivated to learn it while other guys will be intimidated by it and this may even scare them off, especially if we try to shove it down their throat from Day 1.

OTOH, the people who benefited from the 2000 lbs of meat donated to the food pantry don't care about our ritual. The women and children at the shelter that we remodeled and upgraded don't care about our ritual. The children who get clothes and school supplies from us don't care about our ritual. And the list goes on. 

What we need is a balance. Some guys will just naturally want to get into the advancing line of the lodge and this necessarily means they will have to learn at least that much ritual. During the time in which they are advancing they will hopefully become motivated to learn some of the degree ritual as well. And then there will be the guys who want to work with our charities and try to make our community a better place in which to live. If we are lucky, really lucky, we will get guys who will want to do both.

The bottom line is  that we can't make a real impact in our communities without members. I mean why become a Mason in the first place if you are not going to make a difference in your community?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 7:47am
Absolutely Scott, and I'm not disputing that at all. We definitely do need a balance, or an equilibrium if you will. Again, I'm referring to candidate education and proficiency. If a Mason elects not to remain proficient in ritual after he is raised...then so mote it be...that is his choice. There are many many other ways in which he can serve the lodge and the fraternity. My point was, and still is, that unfortunately nowadays some masons are made masons without having had to earn it the way that I, and I'm sure others had to.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 1:22pm
Originally posted by Adept? Adept? wrote:

My point was, and still is, that unfortunately nowadays some masons are made masons without having had to earn it the way that I, and I'm sure others had to.

Now you sound like me when the FCC dropped the Morse code requirement for amateur radio (aka "ham radio") a few years back. When I got into amateur radio, there were 5 classes of licenses. It was (and still is) a system of incentive licensing which means that as you progress through the license classes, you progressively earn more bandwidth until you reach the top level at which point you have access to all of the bandwidth offered to amateur radio operators.

In order to earn a license, you have to take a multiple choice (read: choice = guess) test. This is not as daunting as it seems since all of the questions AND ANSWERS are in the public domain. IOW, you really don't have to know anything about radios or electronics since all you have to do is memorize the tests. But then there was the equalizer; Morse code. For 3 of the 5 classes, you had to take a proficiency test at progressively faster speeds. You started out at 5 words per minute then 13 words per minute and finally 20 words per minute in order to get the highest class of license. 

Without getting into the gory details of how things changed, nowadays there are only 3 license classes and there are no more Morse code proficiency tests. IOW, you can get the same license I have by taking only 3 written multiple choice tests whereas I had to take 5 multiple choice tests AND 3 Morse code proficiency tests! Am I happy about this? Certainly not! Do I lose any sleep over it? Certainly not! That's where things are today and there isn't anything I can do to change it other that welcome my new amateur radio "brothers" into the hobby with open arms and do what I can to mentor them. They followed the rules as they are today and I can't fault them for that.

So at the end of the day, degree proficiencies in Missouri are never coming back... ever. By the same token, the Morse code proficiencies are never coming back to amateur radio testing... ever! In either case, you can pine for the ways things were back when you came in or stop wasting time and energy complaining about something that isn't going to change. 

Those new guys coming into your lodge today have followed the rules as they exist today so they have earned the right to be called "Brother" in every sense of the word. You don't have to like it, but please don't hold it against them just because they did not become a Mason at the same time you did. They are your Brothers.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2015 at 1:36pm
But here in Maine...we DO have proficiency requirements. But I have seen...unfortunately more often than not... Candidates fail to do the work required to pass proficiency, and yet are made masons anyway. Perhaps you're right, and I shouldn't hold it against them, or perhaps I should hold it against them for not caring enough to do the work, AND all the brothers of the lodge (myself included for not speaking my mind in the moment) for not holding the candidate, and ourselves accountable to our own constitution and by laws.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2015 at 3:57pm
After further reflection on the subject, I have decided that you are right Brother Scott. Any candidate, regularly initiated, and made a Mason in due form is a Brother, whether they had to earn it like I did or not. All Brothers are important and necessary members, and all make their own personal contributions to the order. (Even if it's just paying their annual dues) For the benefit of our beloved Brotherhood and its cause, and therefore the benefit of all mankind.

May brotherly love always prevail.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2015 at 8:10pm
That's the great thing about being a Mason.... we're all brothers. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Adept? Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2015 at 8:19pm
Indeed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2015 at 12:26am
WBScott, why isn't there a proficiency requirement for receiving degrees?  Is it only the Master Mason that isn't required to turn in his work, or is it every degree that requires no proficiency?  I understand that service is an important part of the work, but as an organization distinct from the Rotary Club, etc., if there's no proficiency requirement, what's the point?

I'd be interested to know why the MO Grand Lodge decided that memory work (or some other such demonstration of commitment and understanding) was not necessary to the purpose.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2015 at 8:53am
There was a proficiency requirement for all degrees in Missouri but that has been gone for at least 15 years. However, there is still Masonic education.

Why? I wasn't consulted on the matter, but I am sure that the fact that membership has been dropping played a large part of that decision. I am the secretary of two lodges and between them, there are 12 members who became Entered Apprentices "back in the day" and never went any further. 

Some will say that if they did not have the level of commitment to learn the proficiency then they would probably would not have made good Masons. But then again, we will never know. Actually we could know because in Missouri they can still petition their lodge for advancement and if approved, continue on the path of enlightenment.

So what's the point of having an organization if there is no proficiency requirement? If we still had a proficiency requirement, I am pretty sure that almost all of the men we have Raised in the last 15 years would probably have joined some other fraternal organization (or not!) and the community at large would still benefit which is all that really matters. But the bottom line is that they are now Masons and it is up to us to make that experience as meaningful as possible, for us and them.


Edited by WBScott - September/05/2015 at 8:54am
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Pride of the West (MO) Lodge #179 - PM (twice)
Pauldingville (MO) Lodge #11 - Secretary
Warrenton (MO) Lodge #609 - Secretary
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/06/2015 at 1:26pm
WBScott, I understand completely about proficiency work scaring off some people!  The first time I sat next to a guy and heard him go through what he had to turn in for his EA I know I was more than a little intimidated. 

Since there's nothing memorized, how do you normally try visitors in MO lodges, and do MO members have trouble when visiting other jurisdictions?  As far as I have been told, a part of why we do the memory work is to provide proof of membership (in addition to dues cards, tokens, etc.).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/06/2015 at 4:08pm
When a "traveler" visits one of my lodges and no one can vouch for him, the first thing I do is look at his dues card. If it is current and his lodge and Grand Lodge are in the book of lodges with whom the Grand Lodge of Missouri recognizes, I gather together 2 or 3 "senior" members of the lodge to examine him. In truth, we usually just make sure he knows the signs and passwords for all the degrees. One of the team of examiners may or may not ask him some very basic questions. When we are all satisfied he is a true and lawful brother, we give the him Tiler's Oath. That's it.

As far as visiting other jurisdictions, I have been to lodges in Illinois, North Carolina and South Dakota and what I went through is pretty much what I described above. Last year we went to Canada and I went to a lodge there. I know a lot of people don't consider Canada to be a "foreign" country since they are so close, but the lodge I went to in Quebec City was entirely in French! Let me tell you, it is a foreign country to be sure!

Later this Fall (but will now probably be put off until some time next year) we are planning to visit Cuba. In that case, I contacted the Grand Lodge and they issued a formal letter of introduction signed by the Grand Master and bearing the seal of the Grand Lodge. Hopefully they will honor that.

The whole idea is to satisfy the examination team that the "traveler" is a true and lawful brother and not to embarrass the visitor. We want to encourage "travelers" to visit our little country lodge, not discourage them.

So as far as Arkansas is concerned, are you telling me that if I come to your lodge in Arkansas wearing my DDGM apron and bearing a letter of introduction from the Grand Master, I will not be allowed in unless I can recite an entire proficiency? Have you ever been on a visitors examination committee or have you ever seen is being done?


Edited by WBScott - September/06/2015 at 4:13pm
Wentzville (MO) Lodge #46 - PM
Pride of the West (MO) Lodge #179 - PM (twice)
Pauldingville (MO) Lodge #11 - Secretary
Warrenton (MO) Lodge #609 - Secretary
Past DDGM - 25th Masonic District
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Quarryman
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightbound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/06/2015 at 10:26pm
Not saying that at all!  I just thought that, beyond dues cards etc., memory work was a part of preparation for being tried when travelling.

I think you might feel like I'm impugning Freemasonry in places where proficiency doesn't need to be demonstrated...that's not at all my intent.  I'm simply curious about how things work in other places, that's all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote log cabin Bill Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/07/2015 at 7:08am
In PA we do what is called "examination of a visitor." After his dues card is examined and is found to be current, and his lodge is one that is recognized, he take's the visitor's O&O. Then he must give the MM word as he received it (that is, accompanied by the 5 p. of f.) Then he is welcomed as a brother. Very simple and easy. Many jurisdictions have a visitor's examination that is similar. Incidently, in PA our regular monthly meeting is conducted in the third degree.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WBScott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/07/2015 at 8:04am
Originally posted by log cabin Bill log cabin Bill wrote:

...in PA our regular monthly meeting is conducted in the third degree.

In Missouri, we can open on any degree and do business on any degree. This works out well if one of our own EAs or FCs (or one from a neighboring lodge) is in lodge. That way they can stay and watch what we do without waiting to be being Raised. It is also the same in Illinois. I was in Chicago recently on business for a week and I went to as many lodge meetings as I could. (sure beats watching TV in the hotel room!) I went to one particular lodge and their recent initiate came to the meeting. The really sad news was that they did not have enough members who knew the parts well enough to open on the 1st Degree so they asked me if I would take the JW chair! I told them that I really did not know Illinois ritual, but I would give it a shot. They said just do it the way you do it in Missouri and maybe we can learn something from you! I have been to several lodges in Illinois, but that was one of the most memorable.

So even though we no longer require proficiencies, being a ritual instructor, I still very much encourage learning the ritual parts for opening and closing a lodge at a very minimum and then work on the officer parts for the degrees. From there, start working on the various parts of the 2nd section of the 3rd degree. And it only continues from there. 

Bro David, I know you have only begun your Masonic journey and I may have come down a little hard on you and for that I apologize. I absolutely encourage you to ask questions. And I also encourage you to pay attention to the "elders" in your lodge but at the same time to keep an open mind when it comes to the way other jurisdictions conduct their business. 

And if you ever feel like taking a road trip, Branson (which is probably the closest Missouri lodge to you) is only about 3 hours away from Conway. If you do decide you want to visit, you should probably contact the secretary first. I don't have his email address but I can get you his phone number. It is always a good idea to contact a lodge before visiting so they can be prepared. That way if you can make it to a lodge in my jurisdiction, you can see the proper way to do ritual! (Just kidding!)




Edited by WBScott - September/07/2015 at 9:40am
Wentzville (MO) Lodge #46 - PM
Pride of the West (MO) Lodge #179 - PM (twice)
Pauldingville (MO) Lodge #11 - Secretary
Warrenton (MO) Lodge #609 - Secretary
Past DDGM - 25th Masonic District
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