Mastermason.com Forums Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > PHA > Prince Hall Affiliated
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - New Book by Alton Roundtree
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

New Book by Alton Roundtree

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: New Book by Alton Roundtree
    Posted: November/01/2010 at 10:53am
The National Grand Lodge And Prince Hall Freemasonry: The Untold Truth
ISBN 0-9772385-0-5
981 pages
 

There has been a dire need for a thoroughly researched book that presents an accurate account of the history of the National Grand Lodge. The National Grand Lodge And Prince Hall Freemasonry: The Untold Truth is the attempt that has accomplished these goals and much more. The author, Alton Roundtree, presents a mammoth account that will serve as a great reference for years to come. The book also presents enough direction and latitude to inspire further research for future publications on the topic of the National Grand Lodge.

Forward

 

By David Daugherty

 

We have come a long way since a Lodge in Virginia turned away English brethren not for their lack of credentials but because of the color of their skin. Yet many myths still persist, about the history of Afro-American Masonry and in this book Alton G. Roundtree exposes one of the biggest. Not only is he well documented with solid evidence but many hard to find documents are reprinted here.

            The first time I learned about the National or Compact was in the early 1980s when I received my copy of the transactions [vol. 92] of Quatuor Coronati research lodge. There were two papers that addressed this. One by Bro. John M. Sherman and one by Henry W. Coil [Bro. Coil passed in 1974]. In his conclusion Bro. Coil wrote “The states rights contingent have convinced many white freemasons that they are the pure coloured Masonic bodies and that all others are illegal, and to this end Prince Hall  has been used convincingly, although neither party has any ancestral or historical connection with that early and once repudiated character” Although Coil seemed to conclude that Prince Hall is itself Bogus, I shared this quote with you not to get in a debate over legitimacy or recognition but to introduce you into the tangled relationship and shared history of Prince Halls and the National or Compact Grand Lodges.

            The truth does not play well, especially when it shows that some of our Masonic heroes did not tell the truth. You will discover Prince Hall Lodges that were given birth by the National or Compact; you will discover mergers of Prince Hall and National or compact Lodges; you will discover that much untrue information has been espoused; you will discover that much of what has been written about the National Grand Lodge is incorrect; and many will be surprised to discover the National Grand Lodge or Compact is in deed alive and well or as Brent Morris so aptly wrote in his forward of Alton’s last book Out of the Shadows,  “the report of its death is exaggerated.”

            The National Grand Lodge and Prince Hall Freemasonry: The Untold Truth was driven by the need for futher research. Chapter 4 of  Out of the Shadows; The Emergence of Prince Hall Freemasonry in America touched upon the National Grand Lodge. The objective there was to show that  the National Grand Lodge was not shutdown. There was a loud cry for more information.

            Much credence has been given to the proposition that the National Grand Lodge is not legitimate. That the National Grand Lodge today is different from the National Grand Lodge of 1847. These and many more myths, traditions and legends have been put to rest in this book, with appropriate documentation.

            Even when uncovered, the truth does not play well. Now that the truth has been revealed, what will Prince Hall Fremasonry and the Masonic world say about the National Grand Lodge or National Compact?

 

Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 1:40pm
going for about $44.95 but hey
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 4:04pm
I hope to read/view this book soon. But I'm just afraid the majority of PHA brothers still wont side with the NGL, despite any info or facts presented.
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 4:37pm
Bro. Smith,
Regardless of choosing sides, it is still a great reference to have. Bro. Roundtree included a great majority of the documents of the past and place them in the appendices. He also clearly shows the lineage of every Grand Lodge of PHA. It would be good for questions to be asked from passages in the book.
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 4:50pm
Is the structure of PHO regular?

I have not met any person that has said PHA and PHO has never merged.  Even "MS" GL's have merged with GL's it considered clandestine. 

Did not some, if not most current PHO GL's, pop up out of thin air?  (GA for example who does it trace to)

Delaware might be the only actual PHO GL from the "Compact" era. 






Edited by Flotown79 - November/01/2010 at 4:50pm

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 5:21pm
I'm not pro-Compact. I'm just saying that there are some brothers PHA that will blantantly ignore the facts presented about PHO. So, in the end, nothing changes. The debate continues.....lol that's all I saying.
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 7:39pm
Originally posted by JLHSMITH JLHSMITH wrote:

I'm not pro-Compact. I'm just saying that there are some brothers PHA that will blantantly ignore the facts presented about PHO. So, in the end, nothing changes. The debate continues.....lol that's all I saying.
Bro. Smith,
I feel you there. I ask questions based upon what I have read. The usual responses are geared around regularity, never around the origins of the Grand Lodges PHO or A.
 
A common question is:
 
Q: If the NGL is irregular in structure, how can those Grand Lodges (PHA) which were established by the NGL be regular?
 
That question is addressed in the book.
 
Also in the book is a chapter devoted to Slander, Lies & Mistruths told by various State Rights (PHA) proponents.
 
I do anticipate book reviews from various Research Lodges and Societies.
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 7:55pm
Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

 
A common question is:
 
Q: If the NGL is irregular in structure, how can those Grand Lodges (PHA) which were established by the NGL be regular?
 
That question is addressed in the book.
 
Also in the book is a chapter devoted to Slander, Lies & Mistruths told by various State Rights (PHA) proponents.
 
I do anticipate book reviews from various Research Lodges and Societies.


Are you saying an irregular, clandestine, ect lodge can't become regular? 

Do we really need to go through this again?  Give me a few mins and I will attempt to post the link to where we had this discussion sometime ago. 







F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 7:59pm
Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

 
A common question is:
 
Q: If the NGL is irregular in structure, how can those Grand Lodges (PHA) which were established by the NGL be regular?
 
That question is addressed in the book.
 
Also in the book is a chapter devoted to Slander, Lies & Mistruths told by various State Rights (PHA) proponents.
 
I do anticipate book reviews from various Research Lodges and Societies.


Are you saying an irregular, clandestine, ect lodge can't become regular? 

Do we really need to go through this again?  Give me a few mins and I will attempt to post the link to where we had this discussion sometime ago. 
 







No we do not have to go through this again. All I am saying is that his is addressed in the book.
 
I wish not to argue.
 
HOTEP!
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:07pm
Question?

Does PHO consider the Interationals (William Banks origin) to be regular?

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
jrider View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: November/05/2007
Location: south carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 77
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:08pm
The Union was supposed to happen after the convention of 1878 Delaware, Wilmington. There the vote was 65-5 to merge in every jurisdiction and become one. The one who voted against the union was W.D. Matthews who didn't want that he would inherit to be shut down. Funny how Matthews was to remain NGM from 1886-1906. Matthews, like Gleaves NGM 1865-1877, would use the system for there advantage. When one GL or Lodge would close and join the rest of the regular world the Matthews, with full power to do so, would  re-warrant a GL and cause more division within our communities.
Men like Lewis Hayden, Past Grand Master of the MWPHGL of Mass., were in contact with men like PGM Findel of Germany, Findel I'm sure help made PGM Hayden to see that to be recognize their is an urgency that you become sovereign.
When all the GL's were to meet in May 1880 in Washington Levere called for a NGL meeting for the very same day and continued with the disagreeable spirit and so 104 years after Matthews death his very own GL, King Solomon GL of Kansas, and George Leveres GL have died out.
We can correct the past by looking toward the future under one umbrella. I doubt that any PHA GL will ever recognize the Compact in my life time. For the Compact to be recognized the regular F.A.M. and A.F.A.M of each jurisdiction would have to agree to recognize the Compact. Now which TWO GLs going to agree to do so?


F.&A.M. S.C.

Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Question?

Does PHO consider the Interationals (William Banks origin) to be regular?
That question is not germaine to the topic of this thread. You may want to post it in a PHA PHO thread.
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:14pm
Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Question?

Does PHO consider the Interationals (William Banks origin) to be regular?
That question is not germaine to the topic of this thread. You may want to post it in a PHA PHO thread.


I asked to prove a point not to make a point of who you recognize or not?

You stated:

Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:


A common question is:
 
Q: If the NGL is irregular in structure, how can those Grand Lodges (PHA) which were established by the NGL be regular?
 
That question is addressed in the book


You asked the question of how does an irregular lodge become regular. 

Again I ask, of these different groups please list one that PHO considers irregular/clandestine.

  • International (William Banks)
  • Maliachi York group
  • United GL of America
  • Grand Orient of the US
  • GL of All England



Edited by Flotown79 - November/01/2010 at 8:17pm

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:20pm
[ [/QUOTE]

You asked the question of how does an irregular lodge become regular. 
 
[/QUOTE]
No I did not. I stated that is a common question and the book The National Grand Lodge And Prince Hall Freemasonry: The Untold Truth addresses this question. As I said before this thead is regarding a new Prince Hall Book by a Prince Hall author. Since the spririt of recents threads have been about literature and what are good books to get. I will say that this is one.
 
Peace to all!!!
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/01/2010 at 8:26pm

How about this question?

Is there any GL that PHO considers clandestine?


F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 9:45am
Here is a little history of PHO http://www.mwnationalgrandlodge.org/NGL_History.htm
 
"PRINCE HALL ORIGIN: The name Prince Hall being associated with a Grand Lodge resulted from a Grand Warrant issued by the National Masons (Colored), to the Prince Hall Grand Lodge in Boston, Mass. in 1848; one year after the Grand Lodge of Free and Accepted Ancient York Masons (Colored), to the Prince Hall Grand Lodge in Boston, Mass. It was on April 28, 1848 that the National Grand Lodge presented the Old African Grand Lodge of Boston a new State warrant under the name Prince Hall Grand Lodge. In most of the early States the warrants and charters for constituting a Grand Lodge were granted by the National Grand Lodge. From 1848 to 1888 the National Grand Lodge issued nearly all of the Warrants and Charters for Grand Lodges. Around 1863 there came dissension and disagreement among the members of the National Grand Lodge and some of the delegates walked out. From the group that left the National Grand Lodge, charters were secured by them to practice masonry under the sanction of the State. This group later took the name Prince Hall Masons, who are often referred to as "State Rite" Masons."  
 
 
 
 
 
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 9:49am
Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:


How about this question?

Is there any GL that PHO considers clandestine?

Now i don't know if I'm wrong or right, but i will assume that PHO will not consider anybody clandestine because they want to be considered a regular lodge.
 
How can you consider the "majority" clandy if you're considerd clandy by the "majority".
That kinda like telling the popular kids they can't sit with you be they're popular.
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 12:17pm
Once again I would encourage all to get this book. With regards to regularity v. cladestine, you can have that debate on the numerous PHA v. PHO threads. The book is those who really are interested in the history of Prince Hall Freemasonry. The truth that is.
 
 
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
jrider View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: November/05/2007
Location: south carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 77
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 3:19pm
Collection: African American Newspapers
Publication: The Christian Recorder
Date: May 16, 1878
Title: MASONIC
Location: Philadelphia, PA

MASONIC.

The following is merely a few extracts taken from the Daily Recorder, and is simply confined to the first and last days work of the great Convention. Next week we will lay before our readers a full report of the same. This is only a forerunner of what is to follow. As the CHRISTIAN RECORDER has been adopted as the organ of the Masonic Fraternity for the United States, we will keep the craft fully posted:

----- NATIONAL UNION MASONIC CONVENTION. ----- BY ROBT. J. HOLLAND. -----

WILMINGTON, DEL., May 8, 1878.

Agreeably to the call for a National Union Meeting Convention to meet at Wilmington, Delaware, on the 8th of May, a good number of delegates assembled at the Odd Fellows' Hall of this city this morning at 10 o'clock. After some consultation among the prominent Masonic dignitaries, it was agreed to defer the organization of the convention until 2 o'clock P.M., when other delegates were expected, at which time the convention was called to order by A. P. Fausett, M. W. G. M. of Pennsylvania, who nominated John H. Deveaux, M. W. G. M. of Georgia, for temporary chairman, who was unanimously elected. Mr. Deveaux came forward, amid the cheers of the house, and addressed the convention, thanking them for the honor conferred in presiding over their deliberations. He promised to rule regardless of favor or partiality, and hope that harmony and good will would prevail during their temporary organization. He said, "the object of our assembling was a momentous one- to heal the breach which has so long existed in our ancient and honored fraternity; that our conditions is a race required the abolition of all dissentions in our ranks." The speech was eloquent and pointed. The Committee of Reception at Wilmington consisted of Peter S. Blake, John Green, Ezekiel Foreman, James Pritchett. Joseph H. Banks, P. G. S. of R. I., elected temporary secretary. Committee on Credentials- W. T. Scott, III; Thomas Glascoe, R. J. Davis. W. T. Boyd, L. B. Toomer, who reported the following as authenticated delegates: Florida, John R. Scott; Ohio, W. T. Boyd, M. W. P. G. M.: Illinois, W. T. Scott; R. L. Harmony, G. Lodge, C. H. Rigold, M. W. G. M.; T. R. Glascoe, R. W. G. Sec'y. E. B. Hebrew, P. G. M. J. W. Addison, P. G. M. Sovereign Lodge, M. H. Boyer, P. G. M., W. M. Webster, G. S. W. R. F. Nicola, R. S. J. H. Banks, P. G. S., J. B. Lane, D. G. M., Alexander Harris, L. B. Toomer, P. G. M. A. K. Desvernery, John H. Devaux, M. W. G. M., Mississippi; Dr. H. M. Turner, Rt. Rev. J. P. Campbell, D. D. L. L. D., Virginia, James Jones; Delaware, J. Deieham, Jas. H. Jones, Lewis Jones, Delaware, W. H. Calwell, John Rossalter, Pennsylvania, H. C. Cassey, R. I. Davis, Alfred S. Cassey, R. W. G. Secy. Rev. Redmond Faucett, R. W. G. Chaplain, Wm. Nesbit, D. D. G. M. Michigan, Robert H. Gleeves; Kansas, W. D. Matthews, Ala.- Cassin. After which a committee consisting of one from each State was appointed to nominate officers for permanent organization which results in the election for President of Wm. Nesbit, D. D. G. M. Pennsylvania, Vice President, W. T. Scott, Illinois; 2d Vice President, W. H. Calwell, Delaware; Secretary, J. H. Banks, R. J. T. B. Glascoe, Ass't. Sec'y., Rev. R. Faucett and H. M. Turner Chaplain. Committee on resolutions: W. T. Boyd, A. P. Faucett, J. W. Addison, J. H. Deveaux, James H. Jones. Rules Dr. H. M. Turner, A. K. Deaverney, L. Googins. Several other delegates will arrive tomorrow. Here we omit a sketch of the second day's doing and come to the third and last day, which gives the result of the convention and is what will most concern all parties. It is due to say however, the second day was a way of great discussion, and thrilling eloquence. Compact Mosous suffering among themselves as much or more, than they did with the Independent Masons, as the delegation were about half and half. During the Mong and heavy debates it was impossible to tell which were Compact or Independent brothers. HEAR YE! HEAR YE!! HEAR YE!!! PRAISE GOD FOR A UNITED COLORED MANSONRY. A CHASM HAS BEEN BRIDGED- A RENT HAS BEEN MENDED- THE FIRES EXTINGUISHED- THE VOLCANO HAS GONE OUT- THE STORM HAS SUBSIDED- THE WAR HAS ENDED AND THE VICTORY HAS BEEN ACHIEVED BY THE SONS OF UNITY- GLORY BE TO GOD ON HIGH, ON EARTH PEACE, AND GOOD WILL TOWARD MEN.

-----

The Masonic Convention which has been in session in the city of Wilmington, Delaware, since Wednesday afternoon closed their session to-day at 11:30 a. m. The evening session lasted to 12:15 a.m., on the 9th, when an adjournment was had to 8 o'clock a.m. to-day, when the Chairman, Hon. Wm. Nesbit called the house to order, and Rev. Lewis Jones of Delaware acted as Chaplain. No minutes were read owing to the confusion resulting from the stormy discussion of last evening, but a good night's rest had mollified the feelings of the past evening when every delegate was present save W. T. Boyd of Ohio. The hope of a harmonious morning session and a unanimous adoption of the articles of union rested with Delaware and Kansas. These two States, National Compact Masons, voted against the last section requiring affiliation. The former was granted a personal explanation, when he recorded Delaware's five vote with the majority which caused great applause. Then Kansas was called and allowed to set herself right, but that delegation, after voting for the entire resolution, by sections, voted against the section requiring affiliation. The result of the vote, 65 for, and five against was announced, amid great applause. The committee on CHRISTIAN RECORDER reported in favor of adopting that journal as the organ for the Masonic fraternity for the United States, and Dr. H. M. Turner and A. S. Cassey, was chosen to look after the Masonic department of said paper. The Committee on printing of the documents of the Convention was then elected by the Convention, as follows: Rev. R. Faucett, A. S. Cassey, was chosen to look after the Masonic department of said paper. The Committee on printing of the documents of the Convention was then elected by the Convention, as follows: Rev. R. Faucett, A. S. Cassey and Dr. H. M. Turner. A vote of thanks was extended to the G. L. of Del. and to the ladies for their hospitality, and also to the President and officers of the Convention, which adjourned after singing the Doxology and with the benediction by Dr. Turner, the Chaplain. The morning session was harmonious, and the delegates parted in the best of good feeling, believing that they had accomplished one of the greatest results known in the history of our race in this country. Hereafter our Masonic brethren are to be one; proscription will be unknown; the Seventh and Eleventh streets will shake hands, and brotherhood prevail everywhere. Now let Zion and Bethel take the lesson and profit by it.

----- ALL HAIL! ALL HAIL! ALL HAIL!

TERMS OF UNION AGREED UPON BY THE TWO FACTIONS OF FREE AND ACCEPTED MASONS (COLORED) OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, ADOPTED AT A CONVENTION OF THE SAME IN WILMINGTON, DEL., MAY 10, 1878. WHEREAS, There has for some years existed in this country great confusion among the brethren of the Masonic fraternity on account of differences of opinion, growing out of technicalities in the government of the craft, and WHEREAS, Such difference of opinion have been injurious to the masses of the brethren, and detrimental to the influence and usefulness of the venerable fraternity, causing the most severe criticisms and denunciations of our order, and WHEREAS, At the centennial convention at Boston in 1875. It was recommended that a more perfect union be formed by our craft, and believing that the spirit of the age in which we live and our duty to our people demand a cordial relationship to each other, to entitle it to the respect of the whole country, therefore Resolved, That the Grand Lodges of (colored) Masons of the United States in solemn convention assembled, do hereby form a union, to be known as the Grand Lodge Union of the United States of North America, for the following purposes, and under the following restrictions, viz.: 1st. In order to settle any disputes that may occur between Grand Lodges, but not in any manner or form interfere with the internal management of a Grand Lodge. Notwithstanding, it may advise any Grand Lodge upon any matter whatever. 2nd. The union shall be composed of the Grand Master, and one Past Master Mason, to be elected by each Grand Lodge, and at the time herein designated, the representatives of seven Grand Lodges, when assembled shall constitute a quorum. 3rd. No office shall be created in the said Grand Lodge Union, except the Presiding officer and Secretaries, who shall be elected upon the assembling of the Union. 4th. After the close of each meeting of the Grand Lodge Union, all powers of the presiding officer shall cease, except the execution of such matters as shall be referred to him together with the preservation of the records. 5th. Before the session closes the Union shall decide the next place of meeting. 6th. That each of Grand Lodge bear the expenses of her delegates, and the proportionate part of the sundry expenses of said meeting. 7th. The first meeting of the Grand Lodge Union shall be held on the Second Wednesday of May 1880, at 12 o'clock M., in the city of Washington, D. C., and on the Second Wednesday of May every four years thereafter. 8th. These articles to be binding and of full force, when two thirds of the Grand Lodges of the United States shall ratify the same, said ratification to take place on or before December 31st, 1879. 9th. That the committee on printing be empowered to forward the proceedings of this Convention, when printed to all Grand Lodge (colored) of North America, for their ratification, with full power to receive the said ratification, and give notice of the same to each other Grand Lodge immediately upon its reception. 10th. And the Grand Lodges under the National Grand Lodge, and the Independent Grand Lodges each solemnly pledge ourselves to obey these articles, and we recommend that the National Grand Lodge do when these articles are approved by two-thirds of the Grand Lodges wind up its affairs, and adjourn sine die. 11th. We recommend that all regularly organized Grand Lodges and their subordinates having the genuine work of Masons, be recognized as such; and that cordial relations be established between them. 12th. We further recommend that all such Grand Lodges as may be located within the same territorial limits, as soon as possible unite and form one Grand Lodge. It is our opinion that it will be best that each Grand Lodge shall be independent in its own jurisdiction. That each Grand Lodge shall have a representative accredited each other Grand Lodge, and when disputes are not adjusted, said representative may he withdrawn and non-intercourse declared with notification to all other Grand Lodges. 13th. That without interfering with or calling into question the form of Government a Grand Lodge may adopt, or have adopted, so long as not repugnant to the principles and landmarks of Free Masonry. We do agree that all restrictions, or bars preventing the fraternization of all true and accepted Masons, by visitations, Masonic recognition, &c., shall be removed and discarded, and the only test shall be, is be a man and an accepted Mason.

WM. NESBITT, Chairman. JOSEPH A. BANKS, Secretary.

F.&A.M. S.C.

Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 4:39pm
Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Once again I would encourage all to get this book. With regards to regularity v. cladestine, you can have that debate on the numerous PHA v. PHO threads. The book is those who really are interested in the history of Prince Hall Freemasonry. The truth that is.
 
 


The truth is PHO reestablished GL's after GL's left the Compact.  The truth is maybe on one or two PHO GL's are actually original Compact GL's.  The fact is at least one PHO GL functioned 3 or 4 years before it had any lodges.  (explain that one).  The truth is the list of GL's on your Research Society is not accurate, now is it. 

Now if one wants to talk about the truth I am ready.



F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
khaos16 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: March/29/2010
Location: Gainesville, Ga
Status: Offline
Points: 127
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote khaos16 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 5:30pm
Flowtown,

This will become a pointless debate, Compact will quote this book like it is the bible. There is no regular compact lodge or GL.  a book written by a PH brother who sympathizes for the compact, but refuses to join them. Who cares that PH masons believed that the compact died, the ngl that exists today is still an irregular entity. Now that the book is out what is expected to happen? Recognition for the compact??? No!!! 

So why waste the time arguing about the compact. PH masonry is considered Regular by the Regular masonic world and that's that.



Truth & Union Lodge #594 F&AM
Y.B.Y.S.A.I.A
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/02/2010 at 7:17pm
We are talking about the truth.

Now what are the odds that a GL, in 2010 only has three lodges, and they all happen to be in the same city?

What are the odds that a GL, in 2010 only has one "active" lodge?

If we want to talk about the truth, then we need to talk about the entire truth.



F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
jrider View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: November/05/2007
Location: south carolina
Status: Offline
Points: 77
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jrider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 9:17am
Truth be told, the NGL needs to stop creating GLs, like in Texas, with  Grand Lodges in 2010 where there are Regular Grand Lodges present. This is where the contention starts. Now they want to be considered as Regular. If the present GL PHO in Texas  were to legally vote to join the pha body there. The NGL would create another GL. This of practice is dangerous, to say the least, and extremely harmful to regular masonry.
F.&A.M. S.C.

Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 10:35am
Are there any PHO GL's that are recognized by the UGLE?
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 10:40am
Originally posted by Stuntman98 Stuntman98 wrote:

Are there any PHO GL's that are recognized by the UGLE?


No.  The only ones I know that recognize PHO are International, Scottish Rite, ect.



F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 11:12am
1847 the P.H.GL of MA and PA formed the Natioanl Compact Grand Lodge establishing at least 20 state GL, later the state grand lodges withdrew from the National Compact.  PA withdrew in 1849
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
princehall1775 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie


Joined: November/19/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 53
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote princehall1775 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 11:31am
Originally posted by JLHSMITH JLHSMITH wrote:

I'm not pro-Compact. I'm just saying that there are some brothers PHA that will blantantly ignore the facts presented about PHO. So, in the end, nothing changes. The debate continues.....lol that's all I saying.


What facts are ignored? There have been some interesting facts revealed but the fact remains is

1) When the NGL "re-organized" itself it created new Grand Lodges in states that already had Grand Lodges consisting of the very same Negro Masons it was supposed to serve. For some Grand Lodges it created lodges out of thin air just to start a Grand Lodge.

2) The original Grand Lodges that started the NGL denounced it ncluding MWPHGL of Mass which was created directly from African #459. How can you be bigger than what created you? If the NGL was supposed to be "National Compact" of Grand Lodges descending from African #459, and those Grand Lodges denounced what they created is the lineage still "intact"?

Lastly

3) The NGL is an irregular body. All these new "facts" being uncovered are just fun trivia questions that do not change anything. At the end of the day the NGL is irregular. It doesn't matter if it never officially shutdown. Who cares? There is no other precedence like it that is considered regular today. If there is one someone please cite it. Trying to say the NGL is regular and applying regular Grand Lodges rules to an irregular National Grand Lodge it is like trying to fit a square peg into a round hole. It is what it is. The NGL is irregular. PERIOD.

Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 1:21pm
I feel you. This will be a never ending topic.
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
Stuntman98 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: August/25/2009
Location: Colorado
Status: Offline
Points: 443
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stuntman98 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 2:46pm
I feel you too bro.  i add info to show how irregular this group of men who try to mirror PHA mason are.  "The original Grand Lodges that started the NGL denounced it ncluding MWPHGL of Mass which was created directly from African #459." I like the statement.
 
 
I love reading this
S.S. Sons of Light No.77
P.M. Pride of The Walton No.110
MWPHGL Washington
District No.9

SPAIN MILITARY CONSISTORY #99 AASR,PHA
DDGIT Afghanistan WFOT
Grand Technician WFOT
Back to Top
upstateconnect View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: November/04/2007
Location: Mississippi
Status: Offline
Points: 636
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote upstateconnect Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 7:37pm
Hi all, seems like I been gone forever but I see the saga continues, lol............
MW Stringer Grand Lodge Jurisdiction of Mississippi-Prince Hall Affiliated

J.I. Martin Lodge No.#701       Worshipful Master
Back to Top
lightseeker357 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Jacksonville NC
Status: Offline
Points: 377
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lightseeker357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/03/2010 at 8:30pm
Welcome back Bro. Upstate!...Yes, it never ends...lol
MWPHGLNC
Ecclesiastes Lodge #818
http://www.ecclesiastes818.com/
MEGCHRAMNC
St. James Chapter #77 HRAM
Lewis Mingo Consistory #316

"A Lifetime Apprentice."
Back to Top
ARPHA View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 222
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ARPHA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2010 at 1:30pm
This is really a moot point.  I don't care how many book Roundtree writes, the NGL is considered an irregular entity.  That will not change any time soon.  So I say if one wants to be a compact mason, then so be it and have fun with it.  But as for me and mine, we will always be P.H.A. end of story LOL.  We as P.H.A. masons need to get back to the business at hand, help for a poor distressed brother and widows and orphans.  The community needs us and we are bogged down with this mess (LOL). Big smileConfused
Unity Lodge #454 P.H.A.
W.P. Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
Little Rock Commandery #1
J.L.H. Smith Consistory #76
Back to Top
Tar Heel 357 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June/20/2010
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 277
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tar Heel 357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2010 at 3:49pm
Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??
Silver Square Lodge #791, MWPHGLNC

Edwards Evans Consistory #196, PHA

Kindah Temple #62, AEAONMS

Cumberland Chapter #70, HRAM

Bayard-Titus-Johnson Council #2, R&SM

Pilgrim Rest Commandery #11
Back to Top
ARPHA View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 222
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ARPHA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2010 at 4:19pm
No good brother you are not.Thumbs Up
Unity Lodge #454 P.H.A.
W.P. Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
Little Rock Commandery #1
J.L.H. Smith Consistory #76
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/04/2010 at 5:34pm
Originally posted by Tar Heel 357 Tar Heel 357 wrote:

Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??


There is maybe one actual original Compact GL in existence today.  So you ask yourself if it died.

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
Tar Heel 357 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: June/20/2010
Location: Virginia
Status: Offline
Points: 277
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tar Heel 357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/05/2010 at 1:47am
Thanks for the responses so far.  I will continue my studies and reading the posts to this topic.
Silver Square Lodge #791, MWPHGLNC

Edwards Evans Consistory #196, PHA

Kindah Temple #62, AEAONMS

Cumberland Chapter #70, HRAM

Bayard-Titus-Johnson Council #2, R&SM

Pilgrim Rest Commandery #11
Back to Top
bsidepro465 View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: December/11/2009
Status: Offline
Points: 310
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bsidepro465 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/23/2010 at 8:48pm
Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by Tar Heel 357 Tar Heel 357 wrote:

Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??


There is maybe one actual original Compact GL in existence today.  So you ask yourself if it died.
Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM
 
Chairman
NGL Historical & Research Society
F&AAYM PHO-NC
www.nglhrs.org
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/23/2010 at 9:31pm
Note the word maybe.  You say there are four, but I believe the number is less than that.  Is African Harmony GL of DE even active these days?




Edited by Flotown79 - December/23/2010 at 9:32pm

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
BroClaude357 View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: November/27/2010
Location: New Jersey
Status: Offline
Points: 47
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BroClaude357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/24/2010 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Once again I would encourage all to get this book. With regards to regularity v. cladestine, you can have that debate on the numerous PHA v. PHO threads. The book is those who really are interested in the history of Prince Hall Freemasonry. The truth that is.
 
 
 
Sounds very interesting. I will definitely pick this up.
Initiated 2-21-05
Passed 5-19-05
Raised 7-25-05

Bethel Lodge No. 10
MWPHGLNJ
Bethlehem Chapter No. 41 OES
Rising Sun Chapter No. 7 HRAM
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 12:29am
Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by Tar Heel 357 Tar Heel 357 wrote:

Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??


There is maybe one actual original Compact GL in existence today.  So you ask yourself if it died.
Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM
 


Will you please list the official formation dates for these 4 GL's. 

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
khaos16 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: March/29/2010
Location: Gainesville, Ga
Status: Offline
Points: 127
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote khaos16 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 3:59pm
Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by Tar Heel 357 Tar Heel 357 wrote:

Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??


There is maybe one actual original Compact GL in existence today.  So you ask yourself if it died.
Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM
 


Will you please list the official formation dates for these 4 GL's. 

Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM-Jan. 1st 1848
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM-March 27th 1855
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM-1872
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM  Allegedly 1882, but according to History presented by the residents of that territory The Compact Gl of Oklahoma was named Keystone GL and Founded in 1883
Truth & Union Lodge #594 F&AM
Y.B.Y.S.A.I.A
Back to Top
q357 View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman


Joined: November/19/2008
Location: Georgia
Status: Offline
Points: 97
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote q357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 4:24pm
Originally posted by ARPHA ARPHA wrote:

This is really a moot point.  I don't care how many book Roundtree writes, the NGL is considered an irregular entity.  That will not change any time soon.  So I say if one wants to be a compact mason, then so be it and have fun with it.  But as for me and mine, we will always be P.H.A. end of story LOL.  We as P.H.A. masons need to get back to the business at hand, help for a poor distressed brother and widows and orphans.  The community needs us and we are bogged down with this mess (LOL). Big smileConfused
 
I think this is the best response I have heard in regards to this whole thread. PHA or PHO I think its all pointless. I do have a question though. If the roots of Masonry go back to thousands of years B.C., then where did the UGLE get their charter from. Whether I am PHA or PHO it shouldn't matter. The good works that a "Mason" does regardless of Affiliation is what proves him to be a Mason regardless of warrant or charter. The work we do only needs be warranted or chartered by the GAOTU as pleasing and fitting to him. At the end when the Tyler sizes up your deeds prior to entry into the Eternal Lodge he will not ask "Are you regular". Lets get our heads out of the recognizable rubbish to begin clearing the path for friendship and virtue amongst men that can best work and best agree.
MWPHGLGA

Eden Lodge #46 F&AM PHA

Gate City Chapter. #9 HRAM

North Georgia Council #1 R&SM

St. John's Commandery #4

Nabbar Temple #128



Y.B.Y.S.A.I.A

Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 5:56pm
Originally posted by q357 q357 wrote:

I think this is the best response I have heard in regards to this whole thread. PHA or PHO I think its all pointless. I do have a question though. If the roots of Masonry go back to thousands of years B.C., then where did the UGLE get their charter from.


Operative and Speculative Masonry are different.  The UGLE is what we as Masons base what we do off of.  It is like saying what gives Phi Beta Sigma the right to it.  How would the originators have a charter.  Who Chartered the first PBS chapter?  With that line of thinking you are saying anyone should be able to call themselves a member of PBS if they want to.

Originally posted by q357 q357 wrote:

Whether I am PHA or PHO it shouldn't matter. The good works that a "Mason" does regardless of Affiliation is what proves him to be a Mason regardless of warrant or charter. The work we do only needs be warranted or chartered by the GAOTU as pleasing and fitting to him. At the end when the Tyler sizes up your deeds prior to entry into the Eternal Lodge he will not ask "Are you regular". Lets get our heads out of the recognizable rubbish to begin clearing the path for friendship and virtue amongst men that can best work and best agree.
 

Yes there are good works of men, but to be a Mason you have to follow the rules plain and simple.  I can buy surgical gloves and have all the medical books but until I graduate for an accredited medical school I will never be a doctor no what I put on my business cards.

Originally posted by q357 q357 wrote:

The work we do only needs be warranted or chartered by the GAOTU as pleasing and fitting to him. At the end when the Tyler sizes up your deeds prior to entry into the Eternal Lodge he will not ask "Are you regular". Lets get our heads out of the recognizable rubbish to begin clearing the path for friendship and virtue amongst men that can best work and best agree.


It is this line of thinking that make men feel as if they should be accepted as Masons.  Yes they are men but they are not Masons.  Rules and regulations must be followed.  There is no exception.  You see if you truly want to be friends with a member of a clandestine/bogus organization, you should explain to them the truth and stop this we are all the same "Masonically" nonsense.

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 6:08pm
Originally posted by khaos16 khaos16 wrote:

Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by bsidepro465 bsidepro465 wrote:

Originally posted by Flotown79 Flotown79 wrote:

Originally posted by Tar Heel 357 Tar Heel 357 wrote:

Brothers, I must admit that after having read almost half of the 2006 book by Bessel and Rountree, titled "Out of the Shadows," and reading this entire thread, I am still confused.  Maybe I need to read Roundtree's new book.  I still don't understand if the Compact really died or not.  I do, however, believe the NGL and Compact are irregular.  Am I uninformed??


There is maybe one actual original Compact GL in existence today.  So you ask yourself if it died.
Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM
 


Will you please list the official formation dates for these 4 GL's. 

Grand Lodge of Pa F&AAYM-Jan. 1st 1848
African Harmony GL of DE F&AAYM-March 27th 1855
Prince Hall GL of Tennessee F&AAYM-1872
Eureka GL of Oklahoma F&AAYM  Allegedly 1882, but according to History presented by the residents of that territory The Compact Gl of Oklahoma was named Keystone GL and Founded in 1883


Did you know the PHA GL in each of these states was founded before these PHO GL were established?

Penn F&AAYM - 1848
MWPHGL of Penn - 1815

African Harmony Del - 1855
MWPHGL of Del - 1849

Tenn F&AAYM - 1872
MWPHGL of Tenn 1870

Okla F&AAYM - 1882 This one can't be an original Compact GL based on the date you have given, so it does not count.



F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 7:22pm

Flo, what about Delaware? It gets interesting when one looks at the events leading up to the formation of the Compact (PHO).

Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 7:47pm
Originally posted by JLHSMITH JLHSMITH wrote:

Flo, what about Delaware? It gets interesting when one looks at the events leading up to the formation of the Compact (PHO).



African Harmony is the name of the PHO GL in Del.  It was established years after the PHA GL was founded.  From my understand it is not even functioning anymore.  According to its own website there are only three lodges and they happen to be in the same city. 



F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 8:36pm
I mean have you looked at how the PHA GL of Delaware was formed? Its origin wasn't 'regular'. 
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
Flotown79 View Drop Down
Administrator
Administrator
Avatar

Joined: November/06/2007
Location: Hoover, AL
Status: Offline
Points: 5115
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flotown79 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/28/2010 at 8:57pm
Lost?!?!?

F. E. Thomas III, MPS
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/29/2010 at 4:10am
Flo, research how the PH GL of DE got formed. You'll see what I'm talking about. Ill hit you later.
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
JLHSMITH View Drop Down
Quarryman
Quarryman
Avatar

Joined: July/14/2009
Location: Little Rock, AR
Status: Offline
Points: 860
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JLHSMITH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/29/2010 at 7:56am
The Hiram GL of PA started what is now PHA of DE. This fact gets ignored often.
Unity Lodge #454
W.P.Brown Chapter #142 HRAM
E. J. Jackson #8 KT
Mohammed Temple #34 AEAONMS
J.L.H.Smith Consistory #76 USC SJ PHA
MWPHGLARK
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 10.03
Copyright ©2001-2011 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.